Podcast Episode #402
SUBSCRIBE: iTunes • RSS • Stitcher • TuneIn Radio • Google Play • iHeart Radio
We turn our attention to denominations today and examine eight reasons many of them are struggling.
Some highlights from today’s episode include:
- Getting angry about your circumstances never accomplishes anything.
- One major reason denominations boomed in the late 20th century was because they were reaching cultural Christians.
- Infighting often causes denominations to make up a fight just to make sure there’s a fight going on.
- Denominational infighting keeps the denomination from focusing on the Great Commission.
- Statistics and numbers are a reflection of denominational reality.
The eight reasons for denominational struggle that we cover are:
- The common factor used to be theology
- Anger at change
- Holding on to the methods of the past
- Deflected blame
- Infighting
- Refusal to see reality
- Attempts to change with old wineskins
- Failure to see their clear purpose
Episode Sponsors
Vanderbloemen Search Group is the premier pastor search firm dedicated to helping churches and ministries build great teams. Their Fall Lead Pastor and Executive Pastor Coaching Networks are now open for registration, and our very own Dr. Rainer will be speaking at the Fall Lead Pastor Coaching Network.
So if you’re a Lead Pastor or an Executive Pastor looking for peer roundtable coaching, check it out at vanderbloemen.com/coaching. It’s limited to 16 folks, so apply today before it fills up.
Midwestern Seminary is interested in helping you get to the field faster. And they’re serious about training leaders for the church. That’s why they’ve created the all-new Accelerate Program. In Midwestern’s Accelerate Program, students earn both Bachelor of Arts degree and Master of Divinity degree in just 5 years of intensive study. That’s a B.A. and an M.Div. at the same time. This innovative residential program combines rigorous academic training with practical ministry preparation, resulting in one of the most effective programs around, so that you can pursue your ministry calling as soon as possible.
Two degrees in five years – all in one program: Accelerate at Midwestern Seminary. Take the next step by visiting mbts.edu/accelerate.
Feedback
If you have a question you would like answered on the show, fill out the form on the podcast page here at ThomRainer.com. If we use your question, you’ll receive a free copy of Who Moved My Pulpit?
Hey Thom, Seems like these could easily apply to many churches.
For sure.
Maybe because, at least in part, they aren’t biblical and go contrary to the prayer of the Lord of the church in John 17.
Fantastic content. I found you guys about 2 months ago and look forward to each new podcast. Thank you for your time and efforts it is making impact.
Great to have you in this community, Kimothy.
Undergirding all of these points is the fact that the church (all denominations) is FULL of nonbelievers, with many of them, quite often, in positions of leadership. “My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all. No one can snatch them out of My Father’s hand. I and the Father are one.” (John 10:27-30)
Oh that we would hear our Savior’s voice – see with His eyes and hear with His ears!
His church will continue to be His church, even in the midst of struggling “denominations”.
Yes. Unregenerate membership is a reality.
I am part of a denomination. A lot of the churches are close to each other. Doctrinally we believe the same things. Those which are a lighthouse aggressively reaching out to the lost community are growing. Those that treat each visitor as a very special guest are growing. Those churches where the only contact with the lost is the rare visitor who is treated like an unimportant visitor and not a values guest are dying. The visitor gets at most an invite back. The unknown person who walks in who is treated as a guest which is invited out to eat, or later called on the phone or visited at his own house or invited by a church member to come over generally returns. People who have most of their contact with friends is on Facebook are crying out for the personal touch. Sadly many churches are as cold an impersonal Facebook.
Thank you, Kelly.
Thom
When looking at this concern and trying to figure out why? It seems that much of the research shows that most denominations begin with a great passion for bringing the gospel to the world. The passion can change to comfort and gradual drift from the reason they began and become more concerned about the particular denomination’s growth. When the main focus changes from the concern for advancing the kingdom – then, priorities gradually change. The change isn’t planed – however it can happen. My thoughts are – never lose our drive to bring Jesus to our community/world. Denominations come and go – The complications of keeping a denomination alive are vast – however focusing on the gospel, listening to the Holy Spirit and Glorifying God in all that we do is not complicated. My thoughts.
Wayde Goodall
Good thoughts, Wayne. Thank you.
I think part of the problem for the church in finding a solution to these identified problems is that other disciplines already found the answer, but they are not aware of it. This is not a criticism, but an observation. I do not think the denominational model is necessarily bad, and it has many pluses. However, Sociology and organizational theory both have identified that any organization – it does not matter what type – after a period of time ceases to exist for its original purpose, but for self-perpetuation. It cease being what it was started for, and will become simply an entrenched bureaucracy. Reinvention, which will be necessary for an organization to regain vitality, is stubbornly fought against by the organization itself. I think this is the situation for many denominations. The leadership does not realize that their organizations are at that point, and are surprised by the resistance they meet. Bureaucracies are difficult to change. These leaders have a strenuous challenge ahead.
Amen about need for new wine skins! I’m an evangelical orthodox United Methodist elder. I believe our denomination is in need of new wine skins and spiritual transformatIon.
It is interesting how the church rarely chooses to learn from other organizations that have been on the verge of or had catastrophic failures resulting in long term damage. For instance NASA, manifested a declination of innovation, a mandatory increase in conformity to rules and regulations, excessive allegiance to bureaucratic proceduralism, a hierarchical protocol-driven management style that fails to defer to subject matter expertise, structural secrecy at all levels of the organization, and normalization of deviance in decision making. They are unable to respond to issues innovatively – only bureaucratically, politically, and policy-based. Many times the responses to issues are through a self-protective bureaucracy where policies are unilaterally designed to be self-protective of the denomination. (Organization at the Limit).
Working in one of the more restrictive denominations, I have seen this demonstrated time after time. These characteristics block out or handcuff true leaders and shepherds from transformational leadership thereby hindering Jesus’ great commission to make disciples.
It’s a refusal to change. A lack of looking outwardly. Too, sometimes, I think it’s a “power thing.” There are some groups who desire to be in power, to wield that. New members, to them, mean they’re losing their power. They resist that and fight it. It’s a challenging time to be a pastor in America today. Tradition is often a “sacred cow.” That’s not a good approach. The churches, that are open to changes (without compromising the Bible), outward looking, and willing to work together in unity and purpose (without petty squabbles and/or constant criticism of the pastor), are the ones who are growing. Too often, though, this culture is not in the small church in America today. it’s an unhealthy culture. Too, this can be in denominations. The American church is headed down the path of what happened in Europe right now unless we have a prayer movement and become much more “outward focused” (instead of churches being self-centered and all about themselves).
It isn’t always about refusal to change. Sometimes it is about making changes that should not be made.
We recently made a long distance geographical move and are looking for a church home. We will visit some in the denomination of our heart, but I seriously doubt we will choose one of that denomination. More likely we will choose a different denomination.
Why? Because our denomination has in the last few years made sweeping theological, moral, political, and style changes that we personally believe have moved them into doing what God forbids and failing to do what God commands.
There are still excellent local churches and IF we find one of them we will of course be willing to stay and fight the good fight. But if not, we won’t be brand loyal.
Just another point of view.