Podcast Episode #381
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While some circumstances do call for quick pastoral turnover, it’s hard not to wonder if some churches fire their pastor (or the pastor bails) too quickly. Today, we cover the problems that result from this.
Some highlights from today’s episode include:
- Churches tend to hire the opposite of what they previously had. They swing the pendulum the other way.
- When a pastor bails on a church or is fired, the staff is often left to pick up the pieces.
- You cannot execute a vision at once. It takes time.
- For pastors, far too often “God told me” becomes a convenient cover for “this is hard, and I want out.”
- For churches, far too often “God told us” becomes a convenient cover for “we don’t want to change.”
The five problems we discuss are:
- Members lose trust in the pastors, and pastors lose trust in churches.
- Your current church will wonder if it will happen to them.
- The staff is demoralized.
- The vision of the church is clouded.
- Financial waste.
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Feedback
If you have a question you would like answered on the show, fill out the form on the podcast page here at ThomRainer.com. If we use your question, you’ll receive a free copy of Who Moved My Pulpit?
Hi guys! Great article, but I have one question for which I’m going to apologize in advance. It’s the analyst in me. Could you quantify what a short-term tenure is? I’m thinking of a situation we had at our church once upon a time, and the pastor in this case was here two years.
Thanks!
Lyn –
Short term tenure is three years or under.
Great article today. Churches are always looking for the flawless pastor and the minsters looking for the perfect church this becomes a problem for short tenure. Both parties need to realize it take five – years before a church will finally accept a man as the pastor. It becomes frustrating when churches are always looking for the silver bullet in a pastor to bring about change, and will not give them the time to do their job. Neither should Pastor’s bail out before their time.
Great article today. Churches are always looking for the flawless pastor and the minsters looking for the perfect church this becomes a problem for short tenure. Both parties need to realize it take five – years before a church will finally accept a man as the pastor. It becomes frustrating when churches are always looking for the silver bullet in a pastor to bring about change, and will not give them the time to do their job. Neither should Pastor’s bail out before their time.
Right on both counts!
I love your articles and books Brother Rainer. I appreciate your Biblically Practical knowledge. Thanks for all you do.
Thanks so much, Troy.
Sometimes, a man can be somewhere 2-3 years and it’s very apparent that the people don’t want to change. And they have the “hireling mentality.” Which is basically “Do what we tell you to do and there won’t be any problems. You are our employee. We don’t want any new approaches.” They won’t let a man lead. In some churches, a man, over time, is able to put forth ideas and lead the church in growth, both numerically and spiritually. But this isn’t the case everywhere. Good analysis. But truth is: Some pastors are in good places with church people who truly want to see “the Kingdom come.” Others are in spots that are very, very difficult with entrenched power groups that want no change, no leadership, and no new people. They are controlling and they hinder things from moving forward. Am I saying, “Don’t press on”? No. But, too, who can blame a man for leaving, after a few years and with persons who are opposed to any new idea “under the sun” that doesn’t mesh with their traditions and might just bring in unchurched people? I knew of a pastor one time in Charlotte. He was in a tough spot. It was a small church mostly comprised of old people. He asked them to consider changing the location in order to be in a better place to grow. They wouldn’t. So he left them and moved on to a church in Florida. It happens (men leaving) and it’s understandable. But I get that vision takes time to execute. Far too often, though, churches don’t want to change any at all. There’s no easy solution for that, barring a miracle of God to transform the place.
You raise a really good question that I would love to hear Them Rainer teach on (or probably more than likely send me a link to where he already has!).
It is: Where does the leadership of the pastor end and the responsibility of the people begin?
There are thousands of books on how to lead a church to health, growth, multiplication, etc… but what if you prayerfully try everything and things just do not move? Is it ultimately the pastor’s lack of visionary, motivational leadership or is it the congregation’s lack of respectful, submissive following?
Robert, on your last question, I think it can be either one. A pastor, with God’s help and guidance, has to have a vision: a plan to move forward and reach the community, seeing souls saved. But to be REAL and honest, some churches are in tough places to grow demographically. There might be a lack of population, in a spot where there are huge challenges. The pastor I knew in Charlotte was in a tough location that was drug infested and plagued by crime. I’m not saying you quit and don’t try, but to say that churches are the same is not the case. Some have tremendous advantages and a leadership that wants to see people saved, regardless of their status and/or race. They welcome poor people or persons who are not white. Some churches, too, have a history of problems, chewing up pastors, and not wanting to go forward and that reality is known in the community. The people, there, know the church and don’t want to attend it. So let’s be real about that, too. I think a pastor has to have plan, it has to be truly bathed in prayer, and key figures (in every church, there are families that “hold the cards”) in the church have to truly want to grow. Sometimes, in the small church in America, they don’t and would rather die over 5-10-15 years. It’s a “power thing” and “it’s about us thing” rather than a “Let’s reach people for Jesus and help the community we’re in” approach. A church would never say this, but if you look at their patterns and not wanting to accept new ideas/approaches, the culture is there. It’s hard for any pastor to break that. When it rarely happens, it’s an act of God and has happened because of much prayer. Can it happen? Sure, it can. God can turn it around. Does it always happen over time? No.
Thank you, Thom, for all your research and all that you do: to help pastors and bring light to issues that need attention.
I am always interested when pastors talk about staying in or leaving a particular situation without dealing with the idea of call. To me, that’s critical! Did God call you to your particular situation? How did you know? Is God calling you to another situation? How do you know? What happened to your former call? I have served in small churches and in difficult situations for most of my ministry. What I have discovered is that in every case, God had two reasons for asking me to serve there — one related to my own development, the other related to the church. I believe that generally pastors should stay longer — long enough to listen, to reflect, and to discern what God is really asking us to do. Sometimes God asks us to take the longer and harder, more challenging past. God will not give us a task to do that does not also require His strength to accomplish it.
. . . to take the longer and more challenging path.
Though there is clear benefit in doing so, isn’t part of this a reflection of the
fact we ‘hire’ Pastors in the first place. We have created artificial distinctions between ‘professional pastors’ and ‘elders’ all too often which makes the Pastor both a hired hand all too often (rather than genuine leader) and always on the look out for better career opportunities. I am not saying we should not pay at times but home raised leaders are a different breed.
Excellent thoughts Josh! Whether we pay someone or not, you’re right – if someone was raised up in the church, they are not quite as likely to be “led” away because of all that they have invested.